Setting up Offshore - UK resident

[Sherwood]

Hi guys,

I am currently a UK resident operating as a sole trader.

I'm a professional better/betting agent, I use crypto for my currency and everything is done online.

I'd like to set up an offshore company for my betting agency company. I mainly want to set up offshore for distance and anonymity, but any tax reliefs would be great.

What would be the best course of action? Any advice, or recommendations for accountants or lawyers who specialize in this subject, would be greatly appreciated.

 

[drysponge]

Sherwood said:
I mainly want to set up offshore for distance and anonymity
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what do you mean by "distance" & anonymity to what party?

Sherwood said:
but any tax reliefs would be great.
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you wont get any, a single owner company that is owned and managed by a UK resident will become a UK tax resident itself.

Sherwood said:
What would be the best course of action? Any advice, or recommendations for accountants or lawyers who specialize in this subject
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you are currently using crypto only, will you require banking & cc processing later?
are there gaming licenses you require to legally run this business?
budget?
the solution that fits you could be anything from legal zoom wyoming llc to calling appleby for an isle of man solution, dont know with the information provided

 

[Sherwood]

Thanks for the response, apologies for being vague

drysponge said:
what do you mean by "distance" & anonymity to what party?
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For distance & anonymity: We are professional betters/ betting agents. So although this is completely legal it is against bookmakers terms & conditions. Therefore anonymity and distance is helpful.
Secondly it's challenging to set up a company in crypto & gambling in the UK due to both being seen as high risk fields.

drysponge said:
you wont get any, a single owner company that is owned and managed by a UK resident will become a UK tax resident itself.
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Our knowledge is limited, but could we get directors installed in the country we set up and fly out every year for board meetings. Would this then be sufficient to say central management and control of the company is in the offshore territory. As UK residents we would then be paid a salary by this company. With this setup, would we have to pay corporation tax on all company profits or just the salary we take.




All betting is done in crypto, but I would like to convert to fiat for stability and paying my salary. So a business bank account would be helpful.

We are unsure on the gambling license front, we are professional betters/betting agents. So we don't offer a gambling service but we do bet on bookmaker accounts.

Do you know any services that specialises in setting up something like this?

Budget: £15k - ideally crypto payment

 

[Mary P]

Nominal directors will help you with the anonymity part. As for the jurisdiction, it depends on the accurate services your company will provide, to understand whether it needs a license. If we speak in terms of brokerage company registration, I would suggest Seychelles or Mauritius. And, Saint Lucia is also a great option, cause legal opinion would cover any activities you want

 

[drysponge]

Sherwood said:
could we get directors installed in the country we set up and fly out every year for board meetings. Would this then be sufficient to say central management and control of the company is in the offshore territory. As UK residents we would then be paid a salary by this company. With this setup, would we have to pay corporation tax on all company profits or just the salary we take.
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no, UKs CFC tests are not management based, so long as you are the UBO that company is paying UK corporate tax.
see: https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/international-manual/intm191100

Sherwood said:
We are unsure on the gambling license front, we are professional betters/betting agents. So we don't offer a gambling service but we do bet on bookmaker accounts.
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im not sure what professional betters/betting agent means.
are you just placing bets for yourself?

are you aggregating odds for your customers?
are you providing tips or some kind of service where they deposit and you bet for them based no your expert opinions?
this licence may apply to you https://www.gamblingcommission.gov....remote-betting-intermediary-operating-licence

if that licence does apply to you, consider how your incorporation will effect the social/integrity requirements if you incorporate in some blatant tax haven like seychelles (im speculating, i dont know if it would be a problem), you can see all the current licences active right now here https://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/public-register/businesses/full there are american llcs in there, wyoming can keep you off a public list, disregarded for tax purposes it will come in way under budget to setup and shouldn't be much of a headache at all to get done.

Sherwood said:
Secondly it's challenging to set up a company in crypto & gambling in the UK due to both being seen as high risk fields.
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there are resources in the mentor group that can have you set up and banked in the UK (and basically anywhere else for that matter), id recommend you get access to that and then read this guide

 

[brianK]

Sherwood said:
For distance & anonymity: We are professional betters/ betting agents. So although this is completely legal it is against bookmakers terms & conditions. Therefore anonymity and distance is helpful.
Secondly it's challenging to set up a company in crypto & gambling in the UK due to both being seen as high risk fields.
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there are a few providers of such services around here @MichaelUniq and @Creocree as far as I remember. There are even more that can help.

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Winners never quit and quitters never win....

 

[Sherwood]

Thanks for all the articles - read them all

drysponge said:
UKs CFC tests are not management based, so long as you are the UBO that company is paying UK corporate tax.
see: https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/international-manual/intm191100
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So it looks like we are paying UK tax no matter what (unless relocation).
Does this make setting up offshore redundant?, or still worth it for other advantages such as confidentiality.

We could set up onshore , and go with a service advertised here for a banking solution in the UK such as UniqPayments? The betting sites aren't licensed in the UK so we are protected slightly.

drysponge said:
this licence may apply to you https://www.gamblingcommission.gov....remote-betting-intermediary-operating-licence
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I don't believe we need a license.

drysponge said:
there are resources in the mentor group that can have you set up and banked in the UK (and basically anywhere else for that matter), id recommend you get access to that and then read this guide
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Just joined mentor gold - interesting guide thanks! Turner Little and SpectroCoin seems like a useful place to start, are they still rated highly?

Thanks drysponge, really appreciate your help

 

[JohnnyDoe]

You need to be a bit more creative if you don't want to be banned by banks and bookies.

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@JohnnyDoe ”“ Your #1 Source for Guidance in Different Offshore Fields​

 

[Sherwood]

JohnnyDoe said:
You need to be a bit more creative if you don't want to be banned by banks and bookies.
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Would withdrawals from a crypto exchange into an offshore bank cause issues in your opinion?

Would the explanation of betting (even if could provide betting logs) not be enough?

 

[JohnnyDoe]

Sherwood said:
Would withdrawals from a crypto exchange into an offshore bank cause issues in your opinion?
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Yes they can cause various issues if you are not properly setup.

Sherwood said:
Would the explanation of betting (even if could provide betting logs) not be enough?
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It depends on the bank, on the entity you use, on your personal setup etc.
In general terms, putting together crypto, betting and offshore raises red flags everywhere and requires planning.

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@JohnnyDoe ”“ Your #1 Source for Guidance in Different Offshore Fields​

 

[Sherwood]

JohnnyDoe said:
Yes they can cause various issues if you are not properly setup.
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Anyone you could suggest/recommend for help on this type of set up? Or any extra reading I could do?

JohnnyDoe said:
In general terms, putting together crypto, betting and offshore raises red flags everywhere and requires planning
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Makes sense haha. Would onshore be simpler? Considering we will pay 25% CT anyway.

Thanks Johnny!

 

[JohnnyDoe]

Sherwood said:
Anyone you could suggest/recommend for help on this type of set up? Or any extra reading I could do?
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I have some experience in this field 😉 I'm willing to help.

Sherwood said:
Makes sense haha. Would onshore be simpler? Considering we will pay 25% CT anyway.

Thanks Johnny!
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You might even end up legally paying zero taxes.

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@JohnnyDoe ”“ Your #1 Source for Guidance in Different Offshore Fields​

 

[Sherwood]

JohnnyDoe said:
I have some experience in this field 😉 I'm willing to help.
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Awesome, I'll send you a PM

 

[Propeller]

As always, you need to move out of the UK (or the relevant country) where you are dissatisfied with the taxes to a more tax-friendly country like Dubai or Switzerland. Anything else can get you into serious trouble unless you are able to set up a company with a real office, employees, an actual director, etc. Then the question becomes whether the costs outweigh the potential tax savings.

 

[Sherwood]

Propeller said:
As always, you need to move out of the UK (or the relevant country) where you are dissatisfied with the taxes to a more tax-friendly country like Dubai or Switzerland. Anything else can get you into serious trouble unless you are able to set up a company with a real office, employees, an actual director, etc. Then the question becomes whether the costs outweigh the potential tax savings.
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Yes agreed, happy to pay UK tax while living here. More-so now looking for expertise in setting up a onshore company in high risk fields (crypto and gambling).

 

[alpakiwi]

Given the UK's tightened tax environment””especially with the erosion of the non-domiciled regime and stricter anti-hybrid and CFC rules””one strategy might still work: set up a UK holding company and invest in foreign subsidiaries where you own more than 5% and can show real economic substance abroad. If those subsidiaries make their decisions outside the UK, you may be able to bring dividends back to the UK holding company tax-free. You won't pay tax until the dividends hit you personally, and if by that time you've relocated to a more tax-friendly country, you could still end up receiving those funds free of personal tax.

 

[polonieth]

You don't pay tax on winnings in the UK, so what are you being taxed on if you're a professional bettor?

Ok, 100% crypto betting you'll have a capital gains liability if the value of it increased when you disposed of it. But struggling to see what benefits offshore has...