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Relocate to Monaco, how money required?

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Thanks for your very nice compliments, Mario I T, marioIT I think maybe a year‌ ago, offshorecorptalk.com had posted the topic "Who is Peter Taradash"
The stuff recently posted is‍ off the topic of getting a residence in Monaco. Maybe our esteemed host / admin⁠ John Locke will be good enough to transfer it or create a different subject for⁤ the personal stuff about me --

My history is related to the offshorecorptalk.com/ message: Why?⁣ I went "offshore" before that word was coined. My concept; Leaving your home country for⁢ greener pastures abroad and getting a 2nd passport was quite foreign --especially to Americans who︀ who were (in the old days) very comfy at "home" in the 1960s . That︁ was when I relocated to Europe and became an honorary diplomat & dual citizen for︂ the 1st time. My first pamphlet was on how to get a 2nd passport. In︃ those days you could buy in pre-EU days for around $20,000 or get a very︄ good, 1st class PP in Belgium or even Switzerland for free with a short residence︅ or "marriage blanche." Times have changed, but the old PT concepts remain valid.
 
No I would like to obtain tax residency there⁠ to avoid paying taxes. But I may not qualify for it because of huge payment⁤ to them.
 
Getting off taxpayer registries: One of my early discoveries was that you don't have to‌ be a legal resident of a tax haven to get off the taxpayer lists of‍ most countries. In the USA, just having a USA passport means you are always liable⁠ for income taxes on your worldwide income no matter where you live. So before going⁤ to the bother of becoming a legal resident, look closely at the law of the⁣ country you are moving away from.

But for every other country on the planet, (aside⁢ from a few crazy ones like North Korea) you just have to be NOT THERE︀ physically for a full fiscal year. Needless to say you won't be tax free if︁ you have any income (like rents) from many jurisdictions unless you are OK with a︂ tax to be deducted at source.

For instance --if you own stock in a USA︃ company but physically live & bank ANYWHERE outside that (USA) jurisdiction, for a full fiscal︄ year, your dividends will be sent to your foreign bank, but with around 30% tax︅ deducted. Got that?
 
Agreed 100%
But only dividend will︆ be taxed
Capital appreciation is tax free
 
I think for USA taxpayers who live abroad, capital gains incomes are‍ still "theoretically" subject to being reported and taxed. Of course, the reality is that if⁠ a USA (or any) expat lives in Brazil (or anywhere) and buys a diamond ring⁤ for $1000 and sells it privately for $2000-, well, who is to know about the⁣ unreported capital gain (unless an ex-wife or girlfriend haha) reports it.

Don't laugh too loudly⁢ as in my career as a consultant, I have seen many instances where a spurned︀ woman or jealous ex-business partner reports someone for tax evasion to get even for some︁ real or imaginary wrong. In countries where tax evasion is a criminal offense, this kind︂ of thing can have disastrous consequences. I know of one (rare) case where the "offender"︃ was kidnapped in a foreign country and dropped on a highway in Florida where he︄ was picked up and tried for his crime. Of course, a big amount of money︅ was involved.
 
I'm talking about a European who has USA stocks is︅ liable only for 30% dividend tax. Appreciation is tax free.
 
Yes. That is correct. A‍ foreigner (non USA person) can speculate in USA stocks. If he/she makes a profit on⁠ resales, he/she is not liable for any USA capital gains taxes. But of course, may⁤ be liable for cap gain taxes in their own country of residence if such taxes⁣ exist there.
 
Same theme⁠ repeats again and again with everybody I know who lived/lives in Monaco - "Even though⁤ I can afford it" I try to spend as much time outside of MC as⁣ I can.

It seems that the key to living in Monaco is not being in⁢ Monaco.
 
You got that right, The Monaco cops⁤ actually do keep track of whether "residents" really are physical residents for the required minimum⁣ 6 months a year. Electric, water, and internet usage is monitored. They can tell if⁢ a place has been vacant for months at a time. One (not really a )︀ secret is for Monaco tax residents to have "vacation homes" in nearby rural France or︁ Italy and to sleep (or pay someone else to use it) at least a couple︂ nights a week (their Monaco apartment). For someone who likes Monaco, this free use of︃ a multi-million Euro MC apartment could be a sweet deal. The only catch is that︄ an unfriendly concierge may spill the beans! Monaco has been known to revoke the residence︅ permits of people who spend too much time away from the Principality. PT Pete
 
In psychology, this is called an echo⁤ chamber,confirmation bias of sorts. Most of the "tax" residents in Monaco barely leave! They are⁣ NOT here airing out their grievances about Monaco. We don't hear from them.

In logic,⁢ it's called: Hasty Generalization and False Consensus Effect.

Personal example: When I lived in the︀ US, at one time, I lived in one of the BIGGEST states, CA. If we︁ go about my time spent in CA compared to the time I spent outside Cali,︂ it's <20% in Cali vs >80% outside Cali. ***BUT*** since Cali has the HIGHEST taxes,︃ nobody offered me an 80% discount. smi(&% rof/%

I think this depends, maybe,︈ on whether they are renting and where they came from. 🙄

There is a young man︉ in his late 20s who owns a penthouse in my neighborhood. He bought it a︊ few years back. It's his ONLY home.
I never asked him (I don't ask people︋ personal questions), but from what I've gathered (he likes to confabulate), he does NOT have︌ "La Carte de séjour."

Nobody bothers him, but why would they? He owns the home!︍ It's his only home. What are they going to do? There is NOTHING to revoke!︎

I was in this same predicament a long time ago. I didn't care about the️ carte de séjour. Who is going to claim me? A former colony that got its‌ independence AFTER I left +40 years ago? 🙄

The home in Monaco is mine! 100% mine!‍ In my name! Even if they revoke my carte de séjour, nothing really happens. I'm⁠ still going to be living in my home. There is NO other country that will⁤ be able to claim me, so I guess...it all depends...

If Billy Bahamas (born in⁣ the Bahamas to European parents and has EU passports) moved to Monaco, bought his apartment,⁢ got his carte de séjour, and spent most of his time in the Bahamas, it︀ would make NO difference to him if they revoked his residency or not. 😉

***NOW*** If︁ Benny Belgian moved to Monaco, rented his apartment, got his carte de séjour, and spent︂ most of his time in Brussels, yeah, that guy is super f*cked! rof/% smi(&%
 
I moved to Monaco. It's OK. Just that. Not too many consumer choices. No Uber.‌ No Deliveroo. Amazon Prime works (.fr) though. But it's a bit meh (like everything French).‍

Anyways...

You don't need that much money to live in Monaco and get the residence⁠ card, provided you're a civilized and educated person. The legal requirement of €500k will work⁤ provided you have the right connections, and again, you're a civilized educated person with social⁣ skills.

As per cost of living, you can get by with less than 10k /⁢ month... Which should be peanuts if you're considering moving to Monaco anyway.

Regarding the banks....︀ If you show up with 1 million shekels and are coming from Dubai (for example︁ – you can insert any other shady jurisdiction) – I don't think the banks will︂ want business with you. However, make that 100 million... and who knows?

The most important︃ lesson Monaco gave me is that one is better off paying whatever taxes one has︄ to pay to live wherever one wants to ACTUALLY live in.

That's why moving to︅ Cyprus, Malta, Dubai, etc... is pathetic in my eyes.

There's only one life... might as︆ well enjoy it.

Is taxation immoral? Yes. But I don't care anymore... and I'm leaving︇ next year.

thu&¤#
 
Are you leaving Monaco next year?‌

Curious to know where you are headed to (if you already know it).
 
Some of us are older, and‍ we had A LOT of wild adventures BEFORE there was even an EU, so we⁠ can't hold it against those who don't like boring Monaco. Also, (I think) he is⁤ more of a family person. Assuming his family is a real good family, he should⁣ do what makes him happy and be around his family!

I'm a misanthrope, so I⁢ prefer animals rather than people. I avoid people at ALL costs! Monaco is 100% for︀ me! It's made for me.

I don't like (friendly) people! 🙄

PS. I'll leave it up︁ to him to disclose his origins...if he feels like it. I have NO right to︂ speak for him! We'll miss you @saintjohnny. Leave on good terms. Maybe later, you︃ would want to move back! Who knows... Life and the world are akin to a︄ boomerang. 😉

PSS. I think the Dutch call this phenomenon: HEIMWEE (Heimwee - Wikipedia)
 
Now a question comes to mind. Do you have a pet as a partner? Sounds⁠ like something we shouldn't dig into any further!
 
yeah I agree. If you have ties to your home country‍ and it's not a complete shithole... after a while you feel like a foreigner anywhere⁠ else and think that going back "home" will be the most natural thing to do.⁤
The issue is that when you return to your home country, after many years abroad,⁣ you'll feel like a weirdo at home too and will move back to the last⁢ good one abroad rof/%
I know many people that returned to their home country, lured by︀ favorable short-term repatriation tax regimes, just to move abroad again after a year or so︁ lol

Anyway good luck with it. Happiness is everything in life.
Taxes are not that︂ important after a certain amount. Usually you can always optimize to keep them at decent︃ level, almost in every country.
The biggest issue I find aren't taxes... but bureaucracy, easy︄ of doing business, weird commies and idiotic laws preventing freedom...
 
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