Looking for provider to assist with source of funds for real estate purchase in Spain and Germany

S

Surebets

New Member
Feb 19, 2022
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Hi to all forum admins and experts, need your help here 😉
I have two projects in Germany (one building for 5.5mio eur and a land plot for 2.2mio eur)
There is also a building in Budapest for 8.5mio that looks good for a night club and office building (8 floors, superb location) and couple villas in Spain 😉

I would like to have a full turnkey structure to be able to purchase the listings above with fiat and with maximum possible privacy protection.

All funds are currently in Riga. (cash)

Thanks in advance for your patronage, hope to hear adequate and reasonable proposals.

Roman
 
I hope you don't mind but I moved this thread to the Mentor Group.

Surebets said:
Surebets said:
All funds are currently in Riga. (cash)
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Do you mean physical cash as having funds in cash does not mean the same thing it used to mean?

What is the source of funds here?

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Please note my posts should not be taken as financial or tax advice. Please seek professional advice in that respect.
 
I am the owner of unlicensed gaming platform, we sell gaming credits to agents, who operate slot clubs. However, these are not the typical Novomatic or IGT gaming machines, our agents are using desktop computers instead of gaming equipment. Agent pays 10%-20% of the credits volume which are then sold in the slot club for 1:1 ration. These 10-20% is the profit of the platform. Such clubs operate widely in Turkey, without licenses, as they are masked under “internet club” signs. This business model isn't something you might have come across before, but if you decide to launch your mini slot casino club somewhere in UAE or other restricted gambling regions I can guide you thru.

Roman
 
That type of gaming is not something I have come across. The unlicensed part is worrying. So I take it this income is not declared anywhere naturally? Your pretty much stuck with the cash then. Any action you take to try and move that amount of physical cash into western real estate is gonna involve laundering it which is against most countries laws period. I

Purchasing sizeable real estate in the west especially Germany would be nearly impossible without proper source of funds and in cash not doable. The old days are gone now and Germany is not Turkey when it comes to KYC on transactions. You may want to rethink what you do with such a volume of cash.

Are you not able to obtain a gaming license or use one from an existing party on a profit split basis? You have a working business then be willing to take a profit hit and work legit with license of your own or with a licensed party.

Also your shopping list of property alone is over 15m euros so you have that sort of cash available to get yourself regulated and do it legit right? 😀.

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Please note my posts should not be taken as financial or tax advice. Please seek professional advice in that respect.
 
You mean you have about 12 million euro in cash somewhere stashed ?
 
Martin Everson said:
Martin Everson said:
That type of gaming is not something I have come across. The unlicensed part is worrying. So I take it this income is not declared anywhere naturally? Your pretty much stuck with the cash then. Any action you take to try and move that amount of physical cash into western real estate is gonna involve laundering it which is against most countries laws period. I

Purchasing sizeable real estate in the west especially Germany would be nearly impossible without proper source of funds and in cash not doable. The old days are gone now and Germany is not Turkey when it comes to KYC on transactions. You may want to rethink what you do with such a volume of cash.

Are you not able to obtain a gaming license or use one from an existing party on a profit split basis? You have a working business then be willing to take a profit hit and work legit with license of your own or with a licensed party.

Also your shopping list of property alone is over 15m euros so you have that sort of cash available to get yourself regulated and do it legit right? 😀.
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Appreciate your approach and suggestions, especially the last paragraph to get myself regulated. That's exactly what I have decided to do this year. I have spoken with a guy in London who has a brokerage license and is able to create an income statement for me for 2018-2022 period to justify part of funds. I don't have any structure in place yet to set up things right, and I couldn't find any “step-by-step” guide how to end up having the balance in a EU bank, all cleared. I heard about Montenegro, and seems like they are able to deposit cash in large volumes on your account for a 0.5% fee. Didn't try that yet.

I will consider renting a gambling licence to setup an actual online casino, hope i got your point correctly, but it would be tricky to display statement of funds and payouts to players, since my platform works offline. You can check it out if you wish, it's called : ya888ya. Never paid any taxes on income at all, this is a grey area of gambling.

Don't know why, but most of people think that any high-net guy has an army of advisers, his family office, ecosystem of corrupted agents, bankers and accountants to help him keep an image of an honourable enterpreneur. Looks I am a rare exception to these species, since i still keep everything in cash. And yes, it's stashed 😉

For Germany I thought this could work:

1) get a Cyprus company, registered agents to be shareholders, I am just director.
2) Cyprus company sets up gmbh as a 100% shareholder, I will be the director in a German entity or will hire a nominee directors.
3) Cyprus company transfers funds to its German subsidiary as capital increase or whatever works best
4) German company receives funds from Cyprus company and I go shopping.

I didn't include the part here how a Cyprus company will have the funds deposited to its bank account, but I am sure I won't have problems buying crypto OTC in Riga and sending it to an Estonian exchanger to a Cyprus bank in which I will have a Cyprus entity and Estonian exchanger will to a interbank transfer to my Cyprus company within same bank.

Last edited: Feb 21, 2022
 
Surebets said:
Surebets said:
Appreciate your approach and suggestions, especially the last paragraph to get myself regulated. That's exactly what I have decided to do this year. I have spoken with a guy in London who has a brokerage license and is able to create an income statement for me for 2018-2022 period to justify part of funds. I don't have any structure in place yet to set up things right, and I couldn't find any “step-by-step” guide how to end up having the balance in a EU bank, all cleared. I heard about Montenegro, and seems like they are able to deposit cash in large volumes on your account for a 0.5% fee. Didn't try that yet.

I will consider renting a gambling licence to setup an actual online casino, hope i got your point correctly, but it would be tricky to display statement of funds and payouts to players, since my platform works offline. You can check it out if you wish, it's called : ya888ya. Never paid any taxes on income at all, this is a grey area of gambling.

Don't know why, but most of people think that any high-net guy has an army of advisers, his family office, ecosystem of corrupted agents, bankers and accountants to help him keep an image of an honourable enterpreneur. Looks I am a rare exception to these species, since i still keep everything in cash. And yes, it's stashed 😉

For Germany I thought this could work:

1) get a Cyprus company, registered agents to be shareholders, I am just director.
2) Cyprus company sets up gmbh as a 100% shareholder, I will be the director in a German entity or will hire a nominee directors.
3) Cyprus company transfers funds to its German subsidiary as capital increase or whatever works best
4) German company receives funds from Cyprus company and I go shopping.

I didn't include the part here how a Cyprus company will have the funds deposited to its bank account, but I am sure I won't have problems buying crypto OTC in Riga and sending it to an Estonian exchanger to a Cyprus bank in which I will have a Cyprus entity and Estonian exchanger will to a interbank transfer to my Cyprus company within same bank.
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@Martin Everson comments above are very accurate and you should consider forming a licenced structure to avoid exposure. All providers, financial institutions etc are subject to stringent AML regulations to identify source of funds and source of wealth.

Now purely from a corporate structuring/setup, a Cyprus holding company being a limited partner (say 99%) of a German Limited Liability Partnership (Gmbh KG) has been one of the most favourable setups for holding real estate. Although German tax would be imposed on rental income (Cyprus company would be the tax payer of German taxes) any subsequent sale of property can be done via sale of Cyprus shares to a potential buyer without being imposed to taxes on Cyprus level.
 
CyprusBusiness said:
CyprusBusiness said:
@Martin Everson comments above are very accurate and you should consider forming a licenced structure to avoid exposure. All providers, financial institutions etc are subject to stringent AML regulations to identify source of funds and source of wealth.

Now purely from a corporate structuring/setup, a Cyprus holding company being a limited partner (say 99%) of a German Limited Liability Partnership (Gmbh KG) has been one of the most favourable setups for holding real estate. Although German tax would be imposed on rental income (Cyprus company would be the tax payer of German taxes) any subsequent sale of property can be done via sale of Cyprus shares to a potential buyer without being imposed to taxes on Cyprus level.
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Thanks so much for clearing things up 😉
 
CyprusBusiness said:
CyprusBusiness said:
@Martin Everson comments above are very accurate and you should consider forming a licenced structure to avoid exposure. All providers, financial institutions etc are subject to stringent AML regulations to identify source of funds and source of wealth.

Now purely from a corporate structuring/setup, a Cyprus holding company being a limited partner (say 99%) of a German Limited Liability Partnership (Gmbh KG) has been one of the most favourable setups for holding real estate. Although German tax would be imposed on rental income (Cyprus company would be the tax payer of German taxes) any subsequent sale of property can be done via sale of Cyprus shares to a potential buyer without being imposed to taxes on Cyprus level.
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99% of gmbh will be owned by a Cyprus company, and the remaining 1% -? Myself ?

To speed things up I think shelf Cyprus companies can speed things up, do you have an agent in Germany you can suggest for such incorporation?
 
Surebets said:
Surebets said:
99% of gmbh will be owned by a Cyprus company, and the remaining 1% -? Myself ?

To speed things up I think shelf Cyprus companies can speed things up, do you have an agent in Germany you can suggest for such incorporation?
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It is best that you form another Gmbh (limited liability company) to act as a general parnter of your GmbH & co KG (limited liability parntership) and not undertake this role individually. This is due to liability factor.

Also a good strategy is to hold individual investments/ assets into separate German liability partnerships. Your limited company acting as general partner would actively manage the partnership and would be solely liable. The limited company can also act as general parntner all your limited partnerships you would form in the future.

I will PM you
 
JohnnyDoe said:
JohnnyDoe said:
There are people who can pick up your cash and send a clean bank transfer to wherever you want, all supported by invoices etc.
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That's a Invoice Factory and has been used worldwide for some time. I just read about a Network in the Netherlands which is well connected to Turkey, Denmark and the UK - all in all they launder 20 and even 40 million EURO each year through this network.

Guess who they main banking form is, NEOBANKS - Wise, Paysera and SachelPay 😀
 
20-40 mio per year isn't much for an invoice factory, wish these would be monthly or weekly volumes )
 
kilor said:
kilor said:
That's a Invoice Factory and has been used worldwide for some time. I just read about a Network in the Netherlands which is well connected to Turkey, Denmark and the UK - all in all they launder 20 and even 40 million EURO each year through this network.

Guess who they main banking form is, NEOBANKS - Wise, Paysera and SachelPay 😀
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It is not in my case, and no EMIs are used, only real banks. Some people need cash, some people need money in the bank, if you match their needs everyone is happy

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JohnnyDoe said:
JohnnyDoe said:
There are people who can pick up your cash and send a clean bank transfer to wherever you want, all supported by invoices etc.
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I was about to suggest that! The only problem is when your company sales are 500k EUR/year, and our of a sudden, they have a turnover of 20 Million EUR. That would raise not 1, but 20 red flags at the same time. Something similar to Olympic games!
 
JohnnyDoe said:
JohnnyDoe said:
It is not in my case, and no EMIs are used, only real banks. Some people need cash, some people need money in the bank, if you match their needs everyone is happy
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very true. can you connect me with such people for roughly 1M Euro in cash?
 
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