HK/SG Ltd + Which country for personal tax residency?

[frankx1]

Hello,

I'm planning a structure for a B2C online business, customers mainly in the EU.
My plan is: HK/SG company + personal tax residency in Thailand, Philippines, Malaysia etc.

The real value creation in the business happens outside of the any of the mentioned countries through third party contractors. So its not like a coaching business where the coach is sitting in TH all day doing video calls and saying income is not TH-sourced.

What countries of the mentioned ones for personal tax residency would you say are the best in terms of relaxed territorial taxation of profits made in the HK/SG company and distributed via dividends? In which country do you guys think is it most unlikely that some government just randomly changes their way of handling things and going into the opposite direction?

Thanks!

 

[Marzio]

Estonian company with Philippines residency.

You would get a EU VAT, EU Stripe, EU PayPal‌ and 0% tax on salary paid in Philippines.

@backpacker seems to know a lot about‍ Philippines

https://www.offshorecorptalk.com/threads/wtf-portugal.39225/page-2#post-236146

 

[backpacker]

Philippines!
Nothing goes fast, everything is blocked by Senate due to obvious⁠ reasons.
TRAIN (Tax Reform for Acceleration and Inclusion) has been drafted in 2017 and -until⁤ today- has only partially passed Senate. All very predictable.
Moreover, the new president is not⁣ exactly interested in reinventing the wheel. Look up local history and you understand that he⁢ has his reasons.

So, if you like to live in an affordable and relatively stable︀ country (typhoons are actually the only major disturbance) than try the Philippines.
Depending on your︁ age, permanent residency is easy to get.

 

[frankx1]

Thanks. Do you think Estonian company is a⁠ good idea when your profits are around $1m yearly and you pull out almost the⁤ whole profit as salary with only one employee (yourself)? Maybe I'm wrong but it seems⁣ like kinda too easy, especially as a EU company.

Thanks, sounds amazing! 🙂

 

[Dandyline]

The most important thing is your access to EU︃ PSPs and Banks. Can be difficult with e NON-EU company in the setup, you should︄ probably include that.

 

[Marzio]

You can't pull out anything that's not considered a reasonable salary.

You can't pay yourself a‌ $1M salary obviously BUT if you are ok in taking out $5K and reinvest the‍ rest then it works.

If you instead want to see $1M in your bank account⁠ then you could form a UK LLP which is tax transparent and still gives you⁤ access to Stripe UK (higher fees than Stripe EU), PayPal UK (currency conversion for EUR⁣ withdrawals) and you'll have to register for VAT in EU.

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

The combo HK + TH is ver common w the HK⁠ tax exemption (careful here, do some research cause if they dont grant it then you⁤ royally fucked).

Also most crypto traders I know in TH use rather SG or UAE.⁣ SG being cheaper obvs and dont have to go to UAE every 6 months but⁢ theres reporting involved.

TH imo, I dont think they︄ gon change anything that will ultimately hurt them and the expat community there is mostly︅ digital nomads on Elite visas.
PH is great too cause things are so mismanaged that︆ you get the heads up waaaay before anything changes and can prepare in advance.

 

[frankx1]

Do you know how likely it is to get SG fully⁣ down to 0% CIT/tax at all? I heard its not as easy in many cases.⁢

 

[Marzio]

What's the logic behind even hoping to get‍ CIT down to 0% by using a SG company to sell B2C in EU?

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

i mean ik its technically possible but i dont know nobody who runs that⁠ set up

more info here






but also this

what are u trying to achieve?

 

[Mercury]

According to @Fred, UAE company package (including substance?)⁠ yearly renewal/maintenance is about 5K USD (18.450 AED). How much is it yearly to maintain⁤ a SG Private Ltd Company including nominee director and audit/reporting fees?

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

https://www.corporateservicessingap...e-to-company-incorporation-fees-in-singapore/
depends on CSP obvs i just found that

 

[Marzio]

Having a nominee director is a surefire‍ way to have your company considered non-resident in SG

https://www.iras.gov.sg/taxes/corpo...rporate-income-tax/tax-residency-of-a-company

 

[Mike Forman]

SG with nominee director will⁠ cost you the same without substance. Depending on the number of transactions and revenue normally⁤ any agent will require you they do the accounting and filing for you.

Personal income⁣ tax is also high for a non resident director, 22pct and next year 24pct.

Obtaining offshore status is as good as impossible as well.

 

[Fred]

Doesn't make sense to compare⁠ SG with UAE when it comes to taxes and running costs - SG has no⁤ chance as the SG Setup has at least the same operating costs and SG is⁣ not 0% Tax.
That's it.

Otherwise we wouldn't get approached︃ at least once a week from an most of the time EU National living for︄ long time in SG but struggling around with the CT in SG - they usually︅ have an old school Seychelles + Belize Bank Account or whatever structure and want to︆ get done something proper with a fully fledged transactional Bank Accoun in a Retail Bank.︇

 

[MiddleEuroAsia]

Not necessarily, in Estonia there is this great thing where you can actually "invest"‍ your profits and you don't have to pay corporate tax on them at all, if⁠ you don't wish to sell them, or distribute the profits, see:
https://www.xolo.io/zz-en/faq/xolo-...article/can-i-invest-from-my-estonian-company
quote:
So, the most appealing options are the crypto, lending︅ and investing in private companies, the catch is, your crypto investments cannot becomes the core︆ business of the company, since this will require an activity license. So around 15-20% of︇ your business profits should be fine.
Then you can make 3-4 UK LLPs which then︈ you can invest "part" of your Estonian profits into (less than 20% in each, so︉ in total around, 40-70% of your profits)
and there is also the loan part where︊ the other party (your own "anonymous" company) can technically default on the loan, and voila,︋ you can do whatever after that.
and of course, there is also your salary, which︌ should be tax free, if you live in a tax friendly country.
Every option from︍ the above Quote has it's workarounds which will help you reduce your tax burden by︎ quite a margin. But it's more complex, than say, opening a UAE company where you️ can have a clear 0% CIT.

 

[frankx1]

Thanks guys for all the valuable answers.

UK LLP also sounds interesting. Do you⁢ know if its possible to run the LLP so that the identity of the real︀ owner is at least not visible to the general public?
Like:
Payments
Stripe
Paypal

Anonymity
Maybe put some BVI(or other offshore locations) companies as partners behind the LLP

Banking
I guess its only possible to get some kind of EMI banking here?

Then distributing all︁ profits from the LLP EMI -> Partners EMI (I guess?) -> Own bank accounts somewhere︂ safe

That's sounds very creative, thanks!

 

[Marzio]

Thanks for the nifty little trick right there 😀

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

this is what i come to this forum for
clap clap clap

 

[Marzio]

You can, for example by using New Mexico⁠ US LLC BUT then again you could have some problems when opening a bank account⁤ with EMI.

Overall it's more hassle than the Estonian model.

If you are willing to⁣ sacrifice some % of the profits i guess you could do even without a company⁢ by using Xolo Go

https://www.xolo.io/zz-en/go