Georgia opinions

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Bofferding

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Jan 16, 2021
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Hi,
Ӭ
I'm creating this thread as I wanted to hear opinions about life in general in Georgia. Like living costs, the people, time to integrate in the society, etc.. I know there are few members here who are still living there or have lived there.
Ӭ
I am planing to visit Tbilisi around June this year because it's hard to get a honest feeling just by watching Youtube videos or articles on the internet. So far from what I saw it fits with what I am looking for. Cheap living costs, territorial tax regime, warm weather, good food and not too far from Europe. But sometimes I feel it's hyped. Ӭ

Do you think as an European, Georgia is a good place to start with in the offshore game?
 
I've been to Tbilisi. It was somewhat boring.
It was Ok, but Batumi was much‌ more beautiful.

If I would immigrate to Georgia, Batumi were my choice to live.
 
Life - boring. What's interesting here? Nothing. 2 weeks per year, that's it.
Warm weather‌ - where did you see that it's warm? There're 4 seasons, how can it be‍ warm?
Food - bad. But it's not bad for those who don't care too much⁠ about heath.
Prices - cheap.
People - I don't know. Good? Bad? Compared to whom?⁤
Time to integrate into the society - strange question. By what criteria would you judge⁣ it?
 
Yes. But it depends on what you're used to.‍ Longer Summer than Northern Europe and many more days with blue sky. Tbilisi has similar⁠ latitude to Rome or Barcelona. There is Winter, but the rain comes in the Spring⁤ so you don't get weeks of cold wet weather like in UK. August is a⁣ bit hot, but not like Dubai and nothing like the humidity of South East Asia.⁢ Not quite Madeira weather, but I would say 8/10.

Get used to having no water︀ for a few hours sometimes. Electricity can go, but not normally for long. Internet in︁ Tbilisi is very good (I think better than UK). Most roads are below the standard︂ you get used to in Germany or even UK, but not as bad as some︃ places I've been to.

What kind of food do you like? This is the place︄ for rustic food with excellent inexpensive wine. You can also go for your Western European︅ food fix without breaking the bank (that's when places like Thailand and Dubai get expensive).︆

People don't always seem friendly at first if you're from a "how awesome to meet︇ you!" and "have a nice day!" style Californian culture. Once people know you, they are︈ super welcoming. My local shopkeepers insisted on my joining their (huge) family for a meal.︉ Two of my three landlords have regularly brought me wine. I find people very polite︊ for example when queueing in a shop, more like Copenhagen than Southern Europe. There is︋ a lot of gesturing and horn blowing when driving (like parts of Southern Europe, but︌ a bit more).

Do you like dogs? Most dogs live in the street and you︍ literally step over them to walk into the Metro. A local chain supermarket near me︎ had a dog live inside the entrance this Winter. Give a little food to your️ local dogs and they become your friends quickly. When the latest Fast and Furious movie‌ was filmed here recently, the city moved thousands of dogs into shelters but they recorded‍ the locations and afterwards they took each dog back to where it was found. I⁠ see this is an example of the "live and let live" culture here.

The language is difficult and the⁣ culture is strong. Georgia was one of the first two Christian countries. Georgian language and⁢ culture are much older than Western Europe. Younger people often speak English while older people︀ (were forced to) speak Russian. When you go to a large bank branch or store︁ then you can usually find someone with good English, but it's not like Malta or︂ Cyprus.

You don't feel hatred for not speaking the local language like in France, but︃ it does take effort when you're away from central or touristy places.

Regardless of where︄ you're thinking of moving, you're absolutely right to visit for a while first. And go︅ to non-touristy areas. I've lived a few places and all of them are loved by︆ some people and hated by others.
 
Forget Georgia. It's fun for a visit to see , but for life it's not‌ a place if you expect western lifestyle.
Also it's not English speaking country. They have‍ their language and their letters, so it's impossible to understand for foreigner. Totally different culture.⁠
If you are from Russia or other CIS countries it might be ok as an⁤ option, because they speak Russian too.
But if you can choose UAE , I would⁣ choose UAE comparing to Georgia

Real estate is cheap but quality is the worst I⁢ have seen even from photos you see that..

Also it's not that close to Europe.︀ Tbilisi Paris flight time is 5h

Weather is also not warm. It can get very︁ cold in winter
 
@Mousel I have a feeling you and I could go grab a mini Boffer someday‌ (soon, before I leave the G.Duchy again), especially that I've lived in Georgia.

PM me,‍ my number on the typical messengers is here: 0bin - encrypted pastebin

My general feedback⁠ is as follows:

- Georgia certainly reeks "developing" country as opposed to "developed".
- Tbilisi⁤ has very bad pollution all year round due to being encircled by tall hills. It's⁣ particularly nasty in the summer where it's plain toxic to breathe.
- There is no⁢ (hardly) such thing as "cheap" service providers here, you have to go to the Big︀ 4 or close to them. Everyone else is just a heap of thick bricks and︁ utter waste of time.
- The same as above goes in regard to many kinds︂ of personal service providers (cleaning, taxi, para-construction etc.). Most of them have no grasp on︃ the basics of what western quality standards and expectations are.
- Taxation is attractive in︄ theory, in practice, as always, there is a fair amount of small print.
- For︅ a non-youngster European, Tbilisi can be a tad boring (I'm 30+ with a family, so︆ well beyond my one night stand period). Most of the local goings out are either︇ European-priced or subpar by some standard or other. The Nomad scene is concentrated along what︈ is essentially one building.
- Real estate is generally meh. You can get a nice︉ private house but there is an utter lack of asian-style resort-like condos unless you head︊ to Batumi. Its inexpensive, but value-for-money, worse than some asian or even island counterparts.
- The local population is not particularly adept at servicing you in English. IF you chose︋ to work in fluent Russian, do so at your own risk, because in 90% of︌ cases it will be a language-barrier solution and in 10% a cause of explicit and︍ misplaced racism (or, at the very least, a protracted geo-political lecture to substantiate the explicitly︎ non-racist position of your overly politically enthusiastic conversation partner)
- Everything outside of Tbilisi gets️ very rural very fast. Expect very little in terms of western standards outside of Batumi‌ or Tbilisi.
- Georgia is not particularly easy to get to from Europe. Especially Batumi,‍ which is the nicer place in Georgia - most inexpensive flights go to secondary airports⁠ and its another ~30-40 bucks to get anywhere reasonable from them, as well as the⁤ stress of taxi-faring in poor road conditions with constantly speeding drivers.
- There's this generalized⁣ "shifting" factor or underdeveloped countries. Things pop in and out of existence quickly, what you⁢ took for granted a few months ago is no longer valid at all and you︀ are a fool for thinking that it is. There is less permanency and establishment to︁ rules and laws.
- Traffic, general tidiness etc. are not all superb.
- The black︂ sea beaches are explicitly not white sand with palms type.
- The medical system is︃ not Sub-Saharan, but not up to modern western standards either (notwithstanding, Georgia has a good︄ grasp on classical medicine and leaps of advance in the medical use of Phage therapy,︅ for example).

Notwithstanding,

+ There, indeed, are, subject to certain conditions, explicit tax advantages to︆ working in GE.
+ Immigration for both yourself AND employees is a piece of cake.︇ No visas or work permits for most countries. Just take a plane and settle.
+ It is non-blacklisted jurisdiction with decent banking options.
+ Its not particularly dangerous, violent or︈ remote.
+ There is a lot of undeniably striking natural scenery, especially in the realm︉ of mountainous terrain.
+ Spring-to-autumn, the coastal areas are very pleasant climatically, very suitable for︊ medium and large-scale farming/garden compounds.
+ Whilst not being a shopping hotspot (like UAE etc.),︋ it's still well ahead of exotic countries from the point of view of availability and︌ pricing of +-decent quality household goods.
+ There is little-to-no corruption in the servicing of︍ mundane daily administrative requirements.
+ The prices are, if you keep watch, lower than many︎ places worldwide. I would say, approximately, a little lower than in a place like Thailand.️ Maybe closer to Philippines after all.

Given all of the above, I wasn't too sad‌ to relocate back to the G.Duchy during COVID.

Georgia is on the "nicer" side of‍ the scale of countries for me, but it's not perfect.
 
Thanks everyone for the replies. It's nice to have opinions from both sides.

I've heard good things of Batumi. I'll definitely visit it if I⁤ decide to live in Georgia.

I appreciate your view.︃
Regarding the weather, where I come from it's mainly cold and rainy. Looking at the︄ historical temperatures of Georgia, the main average is higher than most North European countries.
Regarding people, let's say compared to other cultures, like eg. if they follow traditions, have values,︅ are respectful, etc. Some Western nations have forgotten this.
If you are a foreigner it︆ can depend how fast you can adapt to the new culture. I've lived in few︇ Eastern countries(Ukraine, Russia) and I've managed to adapt into the society very fast. I think︈ it's a combination about your culture, your character but also how your host welcomes you.︉

Thanks for your long reply.

As I said in the previous paragraph, I already lived︎ in Russia and Ukraine, so lowering my living standards is not an issue. Where I️ currently live, life is too comfortable tbh and going somewhere where it isn't is a‌ good way to challenge yourself and see life in perspective.

As I lived in⁣ Russia, I often went to Georgian restaurants where I ordered mainly khinkali and Khachapuri and⁢ I like it a lit. Never tried other dishes beside these two as they were︀ my favorites 🙂.

Where I come from︇ we do have the "have a nice day" kind of people but friendship is viewed︈ differently compared to other cultures. What you describe is exactly how I felt when I︉ met Russians. Very closed at the beginning but with time, they can be your best︊ friends.

Yes 🙂

My Russian is between A2-B1 thanks to‌ the time I spent there and private lessons I took. Do you think English and‍ Russian is enough to live in Georgia? Did you encounter any moments where Georgian was⁠ necessary?

Thanks for your reply. I'm actually︅ not expecting a western lifetstyle but the opposite 🙂. As said previously, I would like︆ to lower my living standards for not taking things as granted.
UAE I will visit︇ maybe one day if my business becomes successful.
I already lived in poor conditions and︈ that was not even in Eastern countries.

Thanks for your reply. Didn't know there were other people from G. Duchy. Good to know.︋ I will contact you soon for that Bofferding 😉
 
Quite easily. When I am in situations where I just can't get by‌ in English I use Google Translate English to Russian (even Google finds Georgian too difficult).‍ I kind of get alexeikarp's point about attitudes to Russia, but I would say it⁠ isn't the language. Young people in particular tend to have strong feelings about politics and⁤ occupation but not the language or people. A lot of checkout staff in Vake say⁣ "spasibo" instead of "madloba".

If you've lived in Ukraine then you know the downsides that⁢ have been mentioned. The criticism Russians seem to have is that Georgian people are too︀ proud and boastful. But they can't get enough of the culture, food, wine or vacations︁ so lol.

I haven't been to RU or UA but I think there's more hugging︂ here (only once you've known people a few weeks).

The vaccination programme could take a︃ while so Georgia might have more lockdowns this Autumn and Winter.
 
Regarding Tbilisi vs. Batumi: If I had to choose a city to live in Georgia‌ year-around, it would be Tbilisi. It is a much bigger city with malls, gyms‍ and other stuff. Batumi is lively during the tourist season, but it hibernates from late⁠ autumn until late spring.

The biggest obstacle for integrating in Georgia is that their language⁤ is almost impossible and the English skills of locals leave room for improvement. Russian speakers⁣ have it easier, so a combination of Russian, English and a few local words for⁢ courtesy would be enough for managing or muddling through almost all situations. The culture/infrastructure shock︀ for people from RU/UKR/BG/RO etc. is small or nonexistent. A pothole on a street or︁ a rude waiter does not traumatize you etc.

Georgia has up-and-coming energy. Despite the language/culture︂ differences, the tax office or bank clerks try to give foreign guests good service. The︃ food culture is a matter of taste - I enjoy the humble ojakhuri, but khachapuri︄ less so. So sure, why not Georgia? I'll be there once the global covid psychosis︅ ends, around they year 2025 or so 🙂
 
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