New Visa to Let Tourists With $130,000 Live in Bali for 10 Years
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Please pay attention to the final two subparagraphs of the post you linked (staring with "PE") and take into account what has been mentioned in post #37, #38 and #41.
Your model doesn't fit into the modern world. Governments aren't that stupid anymore.
On a side note: If you intend to do anything crypto related than you better forget about Thailand completely. No company structure will work in that case.
Your model doesn't fit into the modern world. Governments aren't that stupid anymore.
On a side note: If you intend to do anything crypto related than you better forget about Thailand completely. No company structure will work in that case.
If your company is a holding company and you sell assets (stocks, crypto, ...) twice a year while in Dubai, you have nothing to manage out of these dates. How do you define company management? Is simply owning considered as management?
We're talking about Thailand.
We're talking about Thailand.
Sorry, but if you come here with a dubious company structure, receive valuable advice from may members and then answer "We're talking about Thailand" you should not have asked in the first place.
Since you mention crypto: As said in post #42, everything crypto related is fully taxable in Thailand if you are a︀ tax resident of Thailand. No company structure will protect you from taxation. Crypto is considered︁ to be always with you personally! And since the company is 100% yours, crypto is︂ also 100% yours, even when held by the company.
Use the search function of this︃ forum. Thailand and crypto has been discussed many times already.
Since you mention crypto: As said in post #42, everything crypto related is fully taxable in Thailand if you are a︀ tax resident of Thailand. No company structure will protect you from taxation. Crypto is considered︁ to be always with you personally! And since the company is 100% yours, crypto is︂ also 100% yours, even when held by the company.
Use the search function of this︃ forum. Thailand and crypto has been discussed many times already.
Thai elite visa is a pile of s**t - TIFSOWHO
You buy it because you can't be asked with dealing with immigration, you then find our you are still dealing with immigration.
The perks are mainly tourists traps or golf courses.
The cost of the visa works out roughly the same as having a few days jaunt every so many months on a visa run (upper spending)
90 day report immigration -> still have to do.
1YR visa swap over without leaving -> one perk but still have to do at immigration annually.
= paperwork and dealing with immigration officials.
If you work with the local exchanges, they will tell︈ you, the Gov are concerned with the locals, not expats when it comes to crypto,︉ because the money the expats have is spent locally thus grows the economy.
As for︊ Thai crypto 'tax' etc if you have an overseas company with substance, then it doesn't︋ become a taxable asset.
You buy it because you can't be asked with dealing with immigration, you then find our you are still dealing with immigration.
The perks are mainly tourists traps or golf courses.
The cost of the visa works out roughly the same as having a few days jaunt every so many months on a visa run (upper spending)
90 day report immigration -> still have to do.
1YR visa swap over without leaving -> one perk but still have to do at immigration annually.
= paperwork and dealing with immigration officials.
If you work with the local exchanges, they will tell︈ you, the Gov are concerned with the locals, not expats when it comes to crypto,︉ because the money the expats have is spent locally thus grows the economy.
As for︊ Thai crypto 'tax' etc if you have an overseas company with substance, then it doesn't︋ become a taxable asset.
Indeed, it seems to be the most bulletproof setup. I could just become Thai non-resident staying less than 180 days a year in TH, spending few weeks in UAE and the remaining time elsewhere.
You're right. I just wanted to get some members' opinion on some legit bulletproof︂ workarounds.
Keep in mind that everyone here interprets rules from its non-native translation. Thai law︃ is obviously written in Thai language and nuances and interpretations may largely differ from a︄ Thai a lawyer/jurisdiction perspective.
Never mind, there is anyway no law enforcement in Thailand on︅ foreigners if they keep low profile and their business abroad.
You're right. I just wanted to get some members' opinion on some legit bulletproof︂ workarounds.
Keep in mind that everyone here interprets rules from its non-native translation. Thai law︃ is obviously written in Thai language and nuances and interpretations may largely differ from a︄ Thai a lawyer/jurisdiction perspective.
Never mind, there is anyway no law enforcement in Thailand on︅ foreigners if they keep low profile and their business abroad.
It all depends on the company, for example a lot of companies are actually automated (robots) now...
Arguably going for a meeting overseas for a fully automated company would be something that can contest a overreach in a court of law.
Even Amazon has hired " ___" 1m robots lol
No but when they get a whiff of wealth, they come in like sharks lol, check out the Dutch guy that was sent down for "Laundering" his honest income from weed︀ cafes in the Netherlands, after the Netherlands asked for info to determine if he had︁ done some tax evasion.
They sent him down for life and took all his︃ assets under money laundering.
Recently was sent back to the Netherlands where the government apologised︄ and released him immediately.
I wouldn't live in Bali, love the place for a break︅ every now and again, but had enough of emotional based societies, Europe is so much︆ more civilised after a decade of asia.
Arguably going for a meeting overseas for a fully automated company would be something that can contest a overreach in a court of law.
Even Amazon has hired " ___" 1m robots lol
No but when they get a whiff of wealth, they come in like sharks lol, check out the Dutch guy that was sent down for "Laundering" his honest income from weed︀ cafes in the Netherlands, after the Netherlands asked for info to determine if he had︁ done some tax evasion.
They sent him down for life and took all his︃ assets under money laundering.
Recently was sent back to the Netherlands where the government apologised︄ and released him immediately.
I wouldn't live in Bali, love the place for a break︅ every now and again, but had enough of emotional based societies, Europe is so much︆ more civilised after a decade of asia.
This Dutch guy has been prosecuted in 2015 on the initiative of Thai︄ authorities by a Thai court. The Netherlands itself just asked for legal assistance under the︅ Convention on Mutual Administrative Assistance in Tax Matters.
So, as you rightly say, as soon︆ as these Thais sniff money a foreigner is doomed.
Very interesting to read the reasoning︇ used by Thailand for his arrest which can be studied in this article ->
Dutchman jailed for 103 years for laundering drug money . This should be sufficient warning for︈ everyone who lives as a foreigner in Thailand and owns a bit more than just︉ pocket change.
It will be fun to see what will happen when the first CRS︊ reports arrive in 2023 about wealthy foreigners living in Thailand. There are still plenty of︋ naive, wealthy people who think that it will work out just fine stupi#21🙄
So, as you rightly say, as soon︆ as these Thais sniff money a foreigner is doomed.
Very interesting to read the reasoning︇ used by Thailand for his arrest which can be studied in this article ->
Dutchman jailed for 103 years for laundering drug money . This should be sufficient warning for︈ everyone who lives as a foreigner in Thailand and owns a bit more than just︉ pocket change.
It will be fun to see what will happen when the first CRS︊ reports arrive in 2023 about wealthy foreigners living in Thailand. There are still plenty of︋ naive, wealthy people who think that it will work out just fine stupi#21🙄
Keywords here are "laundering", "drug", "10 bank accounts ... totalling 20 million baht, about 100︃ million baht worth of buildings and condos ... and three of their cars worth about︄ 30 million".
It has nothing to do with thousand of foreign thai residents managing their︅ legit businesses/assets abroad bringing and using reasonable amount of their wealth in TH.
Regarding CRS,︆ Thailand intends to begin exchanging information in September 2023 (Deloitte July 2022).
Under CRS, financial︇ institutions must report annually to their local tax authority’s "non-resident" clients.
Nowadays, most (if not︈ all) of personal bank accounts opened in TH by foreigners are resident accounts as you︉ have to prove your Thai residence showing relevant visa and/or work permit. No data exchanges︊ should occur for such account holders.
It has nothing to do with thousand of foreign thai residents managing their︅ legit businesses/assets abroad bringing and using reasonable amount of their wealth in TH.
Regarding CRS,︆ Thailand intends to begin exchanging information in September 2023 (Deloitte July 2022).
Under CRS, financial︇ institutions must report annually to their local tax authority’s "non-resident" clients.
Nowadays, most (if not︈ all) of personal bank accounts opened in TH by foreigners are resident accounts as you︉ have to prove your Thai residence showing relevant visa and/or work permit. No data exchanges︊ should occur for such account holders.
Did you read the article and followed the story?
What you metioned is the Thai view of things which Thailand could not and did not care to even verify (i.e. made-up allegations). They used the nature of the Dutch man's former business (these coffeshops are legal in NL) which was long sold when Thais came up with this nonsense.
To understand what happens when you get caught in︀ the gorgeous (corrupt) legal system of Thailand, read this -> Dutch Justice Minister flies to︁ Bangkok to discuss the case of Dutchman jailed for 75 yrs - Thai Examiner .
At least the Netherlands admitted that it was a mistake to involve a country like︂ Thailand into this matter and compensated the victim. Most other European nations would not have︃ cared.
As we have seen in this thread, most foreigners do not know what︅ is legit in Thailand and what is not.
Many of those "thousands of foreign thai︆ residents" will be surprised to learn how little of their perceived legit business/assets are really︇ legit in the view of Thai authorities (including The Revenue Department).
Why would anybody care︋ if a foreign country receives data (accidentally or intentialonally) from a foreign tax-resident of Thailand?︌
The other way around makes sense:
This is about Thai authorities receiving "offshore" data about︍ account holdings of wealthy foreigners residing in Thailand.
@wellington and me are talking about safety︎ of a foreigner once it is known to Thai authorities that he/she is wealthy. Very️ soon such a foreigner will become a "person of interest" for various government entities. Have fun negotiating your "security & protection fee" with Thai police.
What you metioned is the Thai view of things which Thailand could not and did not care to even verify (i.e. made-up allegations). They used the nature of the Dutch man's former business (these coffeshops are legal in NL) which was long sold when Thais came up with this nonsense.
To understand what happens when you get caught in︀ the gorgeous (corrupt) legal system of Thailand, read this -> Dutch Justice Minister flies to︁ Bangkok to discuss the case of Dutchman jailed for 75 yrs - Thai Examiner .
At least the Netherlands admitted that it was a mistake to involve a country like︂ Thailand into this matter and compensated the victim. Most other European nations would not have︃ cared.
As we have seen in this thread, most foreigners do not know what︅ is legit in Thailand and what is not.
Many of those "thousands of foreign thai︆ residents" will be surprised to learn how little of their perceived legit business/assets are really︇ legit in the view of Thai authorities (including The Revenue Department).
Why would anybody care︋ if a foreign country receives data (accidentally or intentialonally) from a foreign tax-resident of Thailand?︌
The other way around makes sense:
This is about Thai authorities receiving "offshore" data about︍ account holdings of wealthy foreigners residing in Thailand.
@wellington and me are talking about safety︎ of a foreigner once it is known to Thai authorities that he/she is wealthy. Very️ soon such a foreigner will become a "person of interest" for various government entities. Have fun negotiating your "security & protection fee" with Thai police.
The other way around makes sense only if bank accounts in other countries are considered non-resident. This varies according to each country/bank policy.
In the case of UAE setup I mentioned previously, UAE corporate and personal bank accounts are resident accounts. No CRS exchanges will occur with Thailand.
As a EU citizen and Thai resident, I still hold a couple of legacy accounts in EU with few bucks for convenience and when travelling there. These accounts are︀ still EU resident accounts as I've never updated residence address. If banks find out, I︁ might update it or let them close the account. Either way, CRS reports occur or︂ not, I couldn't care less considering the low amounts in stake.
For your information, since︃ decades there are hundreds maybe thousands of illegal company setups in Thailand in order that︄ foreigners could 100% own property as foreigners cannot own land in Thailand. This is not︅ hidden information. If Thailand really wants to enforce laws against "wealthy" foreigners it's way easier︆ for them to check people "dubious" assets in-country rather than trying to figure out how︇ people have built their wealth abroad.
In the case of UAE setup I mentioned previously, UAE corporate and personal bank accounts are resident accounts. No CRS exchanges will occur with Thailand.
As a EU citizen and Thai resident, I still hold a couple of legacy accounts in EU with few bucks for convenience and when travelling there. These accounts are︀ still EU resident accounts as I've never updated residence address. If banks find out, I︁ might update it or let them close the account. Either way, CRS reports occur or︂ not, I couldn't care less considering the low amounts in stake.
For your information, since︃ decades there are hundreds maybe thousands of illegal company setups in Thailand in order that︄ foreigners could 100% own property as foreigners cannot own land in Thailand. This is not︅ hidden information. If Thailand really wants to enforce laws against "wealthy" foreigners it's way easier︆ for them to check people "dubious" assets in-country rather than trying to figure out how︇ people have built their wealth abroad.
Sorry, but︆ a discussion on this level is pointless: Why did you start asking when you -obviously-︇ are happy with rather dubious strategies?
Interesting, #47 is your own post 🙄
Your understanding of law and regulations requires a steep learning curve if you do not find dubious what you posted. To give you a hint: ->
AND: ->
.... You are required to inform your UAE bank that you are a tax resident of Thailand. Claiming you being a resident and/or tax-resident of another country does not give you a free-pass to︀ not reveal all other tax-residencies you have.
According to your earlier posts you do not︁ even posses UAE tax residency which makes your actions even more dubious.
Good that at︂ least you know how things are ruled.
Unfortunately, your posts tell a different story: You︃ asked about the legality of your shaky setup and if it's "bulletproof" (and received many︄ critical replies).
If you are convinced about your actions, there is no reason to ask︅ or justify the very same. Simple as that. ban-:;
Your understanding of law and regulations requires a steep learning curve if you do not find dubious what you posted. To give you a hint: ->
AND: ->
.... You are required to inform your UAE bank that you are a tax resident of Thailand. Claiming you being a resident and/or tax-resident of another country does not give you a free-pass to︀ not reveal all other tax-residencies you have.
According to your earlier posts you do not︁ even posses UAE tax residency which makes your actions even more dubious.
Good that at︂ least you know how things are ruled.
Unfortunately, your posts tell a different story: You︃ asked about the legality of your shaky setup and if it's "bulletproof" (and received many︄ critical replies).
If you are convinced about your actions, there is no reason to ask︅ or justify the very same. Simple as that. ban-:;
Correct. The farangs money is︌ future thai money from their perspective.
Crs with Thai residency and being "rich" with cash︍ held offshore is not a good idea.
These setups are as you correctly say "illegal" and often︅ (95%+) involve the "spouse" or "gf" of the soon-to-be-less-wealthy foreigners. There is no need to︆ crack down on this as this wealth will stay in Thailand almost guaranteed. De facto︇ "dubious" assets do not exist, the key point is to make sure only approved groups︈ hold certain assets.
Crs with Thai residency and being "rich" with cash︍ held offshore is not a good idea.
These setups are as you correctly say "illegal" and often︅ (95%+) involve the "spouse" or "gf" of the soon-to-be-less-wealthy foreigners. There is no need to︆ crack down on this as this wealth will stay in Thailand almost guaranteed. De facto︇ "dubious" assets do not exist, the key point is to make sure only approved groups︈ hold certain assets.
Source?
From what I understand you need an Emirates ID to open a bank account in UAE, account being De Facto resident.
@Fred Can you confirm?
Again, most of Thai - native - lawyers I spoke to confirmed that income earned abroad (from whatever source) has not to be taxed if money is remitted in TH the year(s) after it has been earned.
Anyway, If one wants to settle in Thailand, instead of reading confusing Thai law interpretations here and there, it is strongly recommended to get proper information for tax purpose from Thai local source.
From what I understand you need an Emirates ID to open a bank account in UAE, account being De Facto resident.
@Fred Can you confirm?
Again, most of Thai - native - lawyers I spoke to confirmed that income earned abroad (from whatever source) has not to be taxed if money is remitted in TH the year(s) after it has been earned.
Anyway, If one wants to settle in Thailand, instead of reading confusing Thai law interpretations here and there, it is strongly recommended to get proper information for tax purpose from Thai local source.
OECD and its applicable compendium.
I suggest you start by reading the following -> Tax residency - Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development
Furthermore it is helpful to study your banks' entire Terms & Conditions. Rest assured that there is some useful info in it which reflects what the above link mentions.
I suggest you start by reading the following -> Tax residency - Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development
Furthermore it is helpful to study your banks' entire Terms & Conditions. Rest assured that there is some useful info in it which reflects what the above link mentions.
False. The newest guidance from the Revenue Department in early 2022 explicitly allows for classification of crypto income as foreign-sourced, provided that the trading︀ platform is located abroad.
Van Laarhoven︅ had a long -term dispute with the authorities in the Netherlands about his cannabis sales.︆ He moved to Thailand and sent his entire wealth of $ 10 million in Thailand,︇ then purchased real estate and other Thai assets. This money was obtained from the sale︈ of cannabis, which even in the Netherlands is a gray area. Illegal, but allowed by︉ a convoluted tolerance policy.
The Netherlands authorities sent letters to Thailand which deliberately mischaracterized Van︊ Laarhoven as an international drug trafficker (read them), presumably out of spite from the long︋ running dispute. Even with their damning content, initial letters were ignored, and the Netherlands escalated︌ several times before achieving any result.
Finally, Thais realised that they were able to condemn︍ Laarhoven, because the money was after all from illegal drugs and, therefore, to catch $︎ 10 million. You can imagine how the assets would be distributed. At this moment, with️ an increasing publicity, the Netherlands saw the mistake, but it was too late. The Thais were bound to the guilt of Var Laarhoven, because any appeal success would raise the problem of returning the confiscated assets and where they went.
Normally these shakedowns are practiced on local Thais. Local black money is plentiful, no risk of international incidents. One must see the case of Van Laarhoven, $ 10 million Thai assets and a criminal pretext delivered gift wrapped by Netherlands, as an exceptional situation.
Is there a single case of Thailand pursuing a foreigner sending in living expenses from offshore portfolio or offshore company?
Van Laarhoven︅ had a long -term dispute with the authorities in the Netherlands about his cannabis sales.︆ He moved to Thailand and sent his entire wealth of $ 10 million in Thailand,︇ then purchased real estate and other Thai assets. This money was obtained from the sale︈ of cannabis, which even in the Netherlands is a gray area. Illegal, but allowed by︉ a convoluted tolerance policy.
The Netherlands authorities sent letters to Thailand which deliberately mischaracterized Van︊ Laarhoven as an international drug trafficker (read them), presumably out of spite from the long︋ running dispute. Even with their damning content, initial letters were ignored, and the Netherlands escalated︌ several times before achieving any result.
Finally, Thais realised that they were able to condemn︍ Laarhoven, because the money was after all from illegal drugs and, therefore, to catch $︎ 10 million. You can imagine how the assets would be distributed. At this moment, with️ an increasing publicity, the Netherlands saw the mistake, but it was too late. The Thais were bound to the guilt of Var Laarhoven, because any appeal success would raise the problem of returning the confiscated assets and where they went.
Normally these shakedowns are practiced on local Thais. Local black money is plentiful, no risk of international incidents. One must see the case of Van Laarhoven, $ 10 million Thai assets and a criminal pretext delivered gift wrapped by Netherlands, as an exceptional situation.
Is there a single case of Thailand pursuing a foreigner sending in living expenses from offshore portfolio or offshore company?
That's nteresting news. Please provide this specific "newest guidance from the Revenue Department" by posting the relevant official guidelines or a direct link.
I am sure many Thailand fans in this forum will be thankful when this turns out to be true.
I am sure many Thailand fans in this forum will be thankful when this turns out to be true.
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