This guy claims you can get a crypto license in Dubai (for about $15K) and bank easily that way?

[PinkCat]

He basically says that you can solve the Dubai banks crypto unfriendliness by getting this crypto license for your Dubai company and then bank without any problems.
However what is real situation on the ground?

 

[DGTLOTC]

Bump on this.

Would be interested to know. Considering getting a licence myself there

 

[Amandograde]

That dude left dubai already. (The vid is also 2y old, lots have changed since).
Better to perfom your own deep due diligence and pick someone else. He provided lots of lets be nice here, so so info but charging a burj khalifa.

Dubai is a lot but not the place you can just do this turnkey with everything provided on a silver platter from the internet, where info turn old so fast.

That being said, a lot is possible but it depends on your business, especially if pockets deep enough.
You now will have to get license from vara and have proper books and taxes.
In just 2 short years a lot change.

 

[OffChance]

That guy's setup involved making a Digital Marketing company and using it to trade crypto. But yea that video is old and there was no bookkeeping back then and everything less strict etc

 

[koohl]

This guy does not tell the truth like much on Youtube is very wrong!

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[PinkCat]

so tell us the truth guys, what is actually possible now in Dubai?

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

PinkCat said:
so tell us the truth guys, what is actually possible now in Dubai?
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Nobody knows for sure; we are all waiting for the UAE government to provide clear guidance on what is actually taxable and what isn't.

I know my fair amount of very sizable crypto traders in UAE and we are all in disbelief tbh, current sentiment is we rather move to SEAsia where they will leave us alone or to MX where ditto.

 

[Thomas67]

TheCryptoAnt said:
Nobody knows for sure; we are all waiting for the UAE government to provide clear guidance on what is actually taxable and what isn't.

I know my fair amount of very sizable crypto traders in UAE and we are all in disbelief tbh, current sentiment is we rather move to SEAsia where they will leave us alone or to MX where ditto.
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Do you have examples of countries and some more details?

In my view things are quite clear for UAE in 2024 (see other topics); the only pending question is whether crypto to crypto transactions will constitute a taxable event I think.

 

[khinkali]

Thomas67 said:
the only pending question is whether crypto to crypto transactions will constitute a taxable event I think
Click to expand...

I like your careful wording. 9% might not be a deal breaker in itself, if the bookkeeping requirement is rational such as NAV. Per-transaction accounting in local fiat currency is insane, for people who do a lot of crypto to crypto transactions.

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

Thomas67 said:
Do you have examples of countries and some more details?
Click to expand...

Thailand (though less so now due to recent changes) is still workable, and I assume you can circumvent the new restrictions by using foreign cards. Other viable options in Southeast Asia include the Philippines, Indonesia, Cambodia and Laos (which is very poor so I cant really recommend it).

Mexico is also a feasible, and most countries in Central America are options, though Southeast Asia generally offers better safety.

Thomas67 said:
In my view things are quite clear for UAE in 2024 (see other topics); the only pending question is whether crypto to crypto transactions will constitute a taxable event I think.
Click to expand...

I am still waiting for a ruling, hoping that by some grace of God there will be a decision stating that personal trading is considered personal income regardless of size. If we don't get such a ruling, my plan is to split my time between Thailand and Mexico, with occasional visit to Eastern Europe.

 

[Thomas67]

khinkali said:
I like your careful wording. 9% might not be a deal breaker in itself, if the bookkeeping requirement is rational such as NAV. Per-transaction accounting in local fiat currency is insane, for people who do a lot of crypto to crypto transactions.
Click to expand...

Sure, also noticed this point. It will depend on the quality of the statement reports proposed by the exchanges. The difficulty is probably not in designing an excel file allowing to do such currency conversions on a per transaction basis, it is more in the use of partial entries and partial exits I believe.

TheCryptoAnt said:
Thailand (though less so now due to recent changes) is still workable, and I assume you can circumvent the new restrictions by using foreign cards. Other viable options in Southeast Asia include the Philippines, Indonesia, Cambodia and Laos (which is very poor so I cant really recommend it).

Mexico is also a feasible, and most countries in Central America are options, though Southeast Asia generally offers better safety.


I am still waiting for a ruling, hoping that by some grace of God there will be a decision stating that personal trading is considered personal income regardless of size. If we don't get such a ruling, my plan is to split my time between Thailand and Mexico, with occasional visit to Eastern Europe.
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Thanks for your view. I've also seen several traders moving to Thailand for 6 months. Was hence trying to make the link.

By ruling I guess you're referring to a tax clarification right. I've also this option in mind to know if 'virtual currencies works' also concern crypto to crypto transactions (in my mind, based on the decrees, personal trading as main activity would be taxable).

Any way, every trader will need a personal ruling as proof I guess, would such transactions be exempted. Might not be needed to submit a request if the answer is negative though. I'll see around me too here in Dubai.

Nb: Cyprus might be another option. My current understanding (to be confirmed) is that crypto to crypto transactions are not a taxable event (profits could be used when setting up a company afterwards). Only issue is that capital gain from forex trading is taxable though.

Last edited: Jan 2, 2024

 

[Amandograde]

Thomas67 said:
Do you have examples of countries and some more details?
Click to expand...

most of the emerging world, you can arrange in all of latam, africa and asia ex singapore, china, japan.

 

[khinkali]

Thomas67 said:
Cyprus might be another option
Click to expand...

I think Cyprus could be interesting if you have a software company that does algo trading using its own IP. If CySEC agree that it doesn't need to be a regulated fund (due to the shareholder capital being from a tight group) and if the Tax Department agree that IP Box applies and that Specialised Accounting Practices can be used - i.e. NAV.

Three "if"s, but it could be the Goldilocks jurisdiction if they did all apply.

RAK or DXB are probably simpler, but Cyprus would be a nice can more cost efficient place estination to live, open an office and employ people.

 

[EliasIT]

I wonder why @EmiratesSetup don't shim with all their knowledge.

khinkali said:
RAK or DXB are probably simpler, but Cyprus would be a nice can more cost efficient place estination to live, open an office and employ people.
Click to expand...

@CyprusLawyer101 @CyprusLaw @CyprusBusiness - they may be able to shed some light on it.

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[Thomas67]

khinkali said:
I think Cyprus could be interesting if you have a software company that does algo trading using its own IP. If CySEC agree that it doesn't need to be a regulated fund (due to the shareholder capital being from a tight group) and if the Tax Department agree that IP Box applies and that Specialised Accounting Practices can be used - i.e. NAV.

Three "if"s, but it could be the Goldilocks jurisdiction if they did all apply.
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Thanks for sharing your ideas. It's probably an interesting option to examine indeed, quite advanced though.

For Cyprus I was more referring to trading stocks, indices, commodities as a natural person (main activity, with social contributions) and doing the same for crypto if crypto to crypto transactions are confirmed to be tax exempted.

For forex or crypto to fiat transactions a company would be needed though, to reduce taxation. With accounting and possibly audit requirements.

khinkali said:
RAK or DXB are probably simpler, but Cyprus would be a nice can more cost efficient place estination to live, open an office and employ people.
Click to expand...

Cyprus is certainly attractive regarding all these costs, esp. when comparing with Dubai. Curious to know why you're considering RAK and DXB as simpler.

Regarding trading operating costs in UAE, I'm wondering if it wouldn't be interesting to find quite cheap accounting and audit services in another emirate than Dubai, e.g. in Sharjah or Ajman (where some have a company/freelance company) even if trading as a natural person in Dubai. To be confirmed if this is allowed and if such low cost services can be easily found obviously.

Last edited: Jan 3, 2024

 

[CyprusLaw]

khinkali said:
I think Cyprus could be interesting if you have a software company that does algo trading using its own IP. If CySEC agree that it doesn't need to be a regulated fund (due to the shareholder capital being from a tight group) and if the Tax Department agree that IP Box applies and that Specialised Accounting Practices can be used - i.e. NAV.

Three "if"s, but it could be the Goldilocks jurisdiction if they did all apply.

RAK or DXB are probably simpler, but Cyprus would be a nice can more cost efficient place estination to live, open an office and employ people.
Click to expand...

This is indeed an option in Cyprus. Having your own software and with the proper structuring could reduce the effective tax rate significantly. It does however require a significant investment and also a tax ruling from the authorities to make the structure as bulletproof as possible.

Happy to PM anyone interested in this.

 

[khinkali]

CyprusLaw said:
This is indeed an option in Cyprus. Having your own software and with the proper structuring could reduce the effective tax rate significantly. It does however require a significant investment and also a tax ruling from the authorities to make the structure as bulletproof as possible.

Happy to PM anyone interested in this.
Click to expand...

Do you think that SySEC will accept a high frequency trading business using its own IP and shareholder capital to trade crypto as non-regulated?

If so, then I am certainly interested.

 

[Thomas67]

CyprusLaw said:
This is indeed an option in Cyprus. Having your own software and with the proper structuring could reduce the effective tax rate significantly. It does however require a significant investment and also a tax ruling from the authorities to make the structure as bulletproof as possible.

Happy to PM anyone interested in this.
Click to expand...

Could you briefly explain the interest, i.e. why a software company with own IP? I guess it's related to a specific tax regime for IP; though, would such a regime also apply to profits from using such a software, as compared to selling/licensing it.

khinkali said:
Do you think that SySEC will accept a high frequency trading business using its own IP and shareholder capital to trade crypto as non-regulated?

If so, then I am certainly interested.
Click to expand...

You can trade crypto in any case in Cyprus, including through a company if you wish to convert profits into fiat. You'll just have the corporate tax and need to use a proper banking solution.

Last edited: Jan 3, 2024

 

[CyprusLaw]

khinkali said:
Do you think that SySEC will accept a high frequency trading business using its own IP and shareholder capital to trade crypto as non-regulated?

If so, then I am certainly interested.
Click to expand...

As long as you are trading own funds then this is not regulated. We can discuss the prospect of structuring it under the IP Box regime, I will send you a PM.

Thomas67 said:
Could you briefly explain the interest, i.e. why a software company with own IP? I guess it's related to a specific tax regime for IP; though, would such a regime also apply to profits from using such a software, as compared to selling/licensing it.
Click to expand...

In very simple terms, under the IP Box regime in Cyprus, any profit from royalties from a qualifying IP asset can have a benefit of tax deduction of around 80&, which could drive the effective tax rate as low as 2.5% Happy to PM you about this

 

[Thomas67]

For those interested by the IP box regime: Cyprus IP Box Regime - Intellectual Property Law - Taxes and Accounting

I don't see any link with trading though, as profits from 'running' the software are out of scope.