Digital Nomads, Biz owners in Bangkok

[TheCryptoAnt]

andrew28fl said:
From what a few people have confirmed, the ground reality is that on Elite visa you live tax free in Thailand.
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Thats what ive experienced there too. They wont go after you and they dont care what you do.
I know people running deca million portfolios from there and its all fine.

Just dont remit money to yourself on the same calendar year and you good, and even then theres people doing that and again nobody is asking any questions.

 

[zzzzzz]

TheCryptoAnt said:
Thats what ive experienced there too. They wont go after you and they dont care what you do.
I know people running deca million portfolios from there and its all fine.

Just dont remit money to yourself on the same calendar year and you good, and even then theres people doing that and again nobody is asking any questions.
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Are they using Thailand residence data (address, tax id, phone number...) with foreign banks/brokers? Up until now there was no CRS reporting only FATCA, this year they will get first automatic data from abroad, I wonder what will happen.

Last edited: Jan 24, 2023

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

zzzzzz said:
Are they using Thailand residence data (address, tax id, phone number...) with foreign banks/brokers? Up until now there was no CRS reporting only FATCA, this year they will get first automatic data from abroad, I wonder what will happen.
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unclear but I dont think so. Most dudes do crypto and i dont think they are using a Thai POA at Binance.

I dont think anything will happen, the expat community brings too much money to TH to play around with it and catch fire.

 

[zzzzzz]

TheCryptoAnt said:
unclear but I dont think so. Most dudes do crypto and i dont think they are using a Thai POA at Binance.

I dont think anything will happen, the expat community brings too much money to TH to play around with it and catch fire.
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Crypto exchanges aren't in the scope of CRS yet, so it doesn't matter. And Thailand taxes crypto, so I'm not sure what these guys benefit with Thai residence?

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

zzzzzz said:
Crypto exchanges aren't in the scope of CRS yet, so it doesn't matter. And Thailand taxes crypto, so I'm not sure what these guys benefit with Thai residence?
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Theres two types of people there in my experience.

1 | Uses rather Singapore Pte or Emirates FZCO. Trades through the corp and pays himself to a foreign bank acc.
Then sends to TH rather the next calendar year or the same one. Nobody asks questions and seems like nobody cares about anything.

2 | Trades in his own name. And same deal with payments. Same thing nobody asks questions and seem like nobody cares.

TLDR they totally leave you alone. The whole point of the Elite visa is to have white people spend white people money in brown people businesses. It helps the economy and helps reduce poverty. Theres imo no chance they play with this.

Just tell your home country you now live in Thailand and be free.

 

[RealDude]

TheCryptoAnt said:
Just tell your home country you now live in Thailand and be free.
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If I return to my home country after 20 years for health reasons and they ask me where I have taxed my money for the last 20 years, what do I tell them?

 

[zzzzzz]

RealDude said:
If I return to my home country after 20 years for health reasons and they ask me where I have taxed my money for the last 20 years, what do I tell them?
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That it was taxed with 0% tax rate in Thailand. Until then, invest also in your health not just business.

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

RealDude said:
If I return to my home country after 20 years for health reasons and they ask me where I have taxed my money for the last 20 years, what do I tell them?
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That you paid taxes in Thailand. You haven't been there in 20 years G whatever they ask for wont hold in court.

 

[JJReddick]

TheCryptoAnt said:
Theres two types of people there in my experience.

1 | Uses rather Singapore Pte or Emirates FZCO. Trades through the corp and pays himself to a foreign bank acc.
Then sends to TH rather the next calendar year or the same one. Nobody asks questions and seems like nobody cares about anything.

2 | Trades in his own name. And same deal with payments. Same thing nobody asks questions and seem like nobody cares.

TLDR they totally leave you alone. The whole point of the Elite visa is to have white people spend white people money in brown people businesses. It helps the economy and helps reduce poverty. Theres imo no chance they play with this.

Just tell your home country you now live in Thailand and be free.
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Is the first setup more bulletproof than the second or am i wrong in thinking this?

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

JJReddick said:
Is the first setup more bulletproof than the second or am i wrong in thinking this?
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yeah its cause you are supposed to get paid outside of Thailand (from a company) and then transfer the money the next calendar year instead of trading under your own name.

This being said, for real nobody is checking anything. In my experience things are done on the slay in TH

 

[JJReddick]

TheCryptoAnt said:
yeah its cause you are supposed to get paid outside of Thailand (from a company) and then transfer the money the next calendar year instead of trading under your own name.

This being said, for real nobody is checking anything. In my experience things are done on the slay in TH
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yes of course I understand that. Just the first setup seems fully legit as long as you pay yourself the following calendar year, whereas the second is fully reliant on thai tax mean being slack as usual. I wonder if one trades and invests in crypto for a living where setting up a company only for that purpose works better. FZCO and crypto dont work great together as far as i recall. Singapore? HK? US LCC? Which of those would be fully complaint with whatever regulations are in place in those jurisdiciton - keeping in mind the purpose of the company?

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

JJReddick said:
FZCO and crypto dont work great together as far as i recall. Singapore? HK? US LCC? Which of those would be fully complaint with whatever regulations are in place in those jurisdiciton - keeping in mind the purpose of the company?
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OCBC and HSBC in Sing will allow crypto np.
Emirati banks wont for the most part but there are ways to make this work.

@Fred can help with the crypto FZCO

Ive got no exp w HK nor US for crypto sorry. What I know for sure is that US LLC wont be accepted in a place like Binance for example.

 

[JJReddick]

TheCryptoAnt said:
OCBC and HSBC in Sing will allow crypto np.
Emirati banks wont for the most part but there are ways to make this work.

@Fred can help with the crypto FZCO

Ive got no exp w HK nor US for crypto sorry. What I know for sure is that US LLC wont be accepted in a place like Binance for example.
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think SG probably best options though i think regulations changed last year and some prop desks moved. Dubai I am pretty sure it's less than ideal and works around are not ideal either. HK would be interesting and only a relatively short flight from thailand if needed. thanks for your input

 

[Skenners]

FCZO is no good for crypto? Is it from banks or from the government side of things though?

I was going to trade in it eventually and was going to just use an FCZO company.

-Skenners

 

[CooperSake]

Global compliance is increasing more and more, and if the structure is Singapore CO, with a single UBO in Thailand, banking in a third country, Well, this is a nightmare for banks, compliance monkeys will assume that this type of structure is tax evasion, and that is before we even mention crypto. To be honest, the future for such shell structures is not brilliant. A LLC of the USA can enjoy a longer life, since, of course, the United States is in its own league, but has problems for crypto, due to the restrictions of exchanges on US entities.

 

[backpacker]

Skenners said:
Its only a tourist visa, long term, so im not too sure about the CRS/FACTA reporting side of things. If its only paper residence you want, proof of residence would just be a rental agreement, right? I got one for 6 months on a regular TR 60 day visa back in October (I used fazwaz to help me find a place). If you're wanting to stay longer then the elite visa might work for you as well.

-Skenners
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The type of visa you hold is -for tye most part- irrelevant. At best it serves as an additional indicia. It never functions as the sole criteria for CRS purposes.
CRS goes by tax residency. So, you need to look at that first.

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

Skenners said:
FCZO is no good for crypto? Is it from banks or from the government side of things though?
I was going to trade in it eventually and was going to just use an FCZO company.
Click to expand...

No good in terms of Emirati banking for the most part.
You can get an exception to this rule w ENBD for example, but requires money and contacts. Some banks can also allow you to transact w lets say Binance but it requires a contact inside that fights a bit for you when issues arises.

The FZCO itself can be used for whatever you want, although ill keep anything haram outside of it. Think adult for example.

Fred can help with this, hes got ways.

CooperSake said:
Global compliance is increasing more and more, and if the structure is Singapore CO, with a single UBO in Thailand, banking in a third country, Well, this is a nightmare for banks, compliance monkeys will assume that this type of structure is tax evasion, and that is before we even mention crypto. To be honest, the future for such shell structures is not brilliant. A LLC of the USA can enjoy a longer life, since, of course, the United States is in its own league, but has problems for crypto, due to the restrictions of exchanges on US entities.
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Not necessarily, Sign banks are very used to the idea of people using Pte's as holding companies cause theres no CGT. Specially in Asia where things are done on the slay in most places and people look for more 'serious' jurisdictions to do biz in.

Crypto is an issue indeed if you dont keep good records. Id recommend that you dont interact with anyone but the exchange.
In the past Ive gotten Binance statements to satisfy the bank's compliance monkeys.

 

[JJReddick]

TheCryptoAnt said:
No good in terms of Emirati banking for the most part.
You can get an exception to this rule w ENBD for example, but requires money and contacts. Some banks can also allow you to transact w lets say Binance but it requires a contact inside that fights a bit for you when issues arises.

The FZCO itself can be used for whatever you want, although ill keep anything haram outside of it. Think adult for example.

Fred can help with this, hes got ways.



Not necessarily, Sign banks are very used to the idea of people using Pte's as holding companies cause theres no CGT. Specially in Asia where things are done on the slay in most places and people look for more 'serious' jurisdictions to do biz in.

Crypto is an issue indeed if you dont keep good records. Id recommend that you dont interact with anyone but the exchange.
In the past Ive gotten Binance statements to satisfy the bank's compliance monkeys.
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Yes.
Generally speaking you dont want to be in the position where you depend on contacts to fight for you within institution, because there are many, many things that can go wrong with it outside the scope/capabilities of even someone as Fred (I'm one of his clients btw).

This is why I was wondering what jurisdctions out there would work seamlessly if one was to move to a territorial taxation country while trading/investing through their corp, obvs with the objective of paying zero taxes while not formally breaking any laws or depending on contacts or goodwill of third parties. I have friends running a prop trading desk in Singapore (they relocated from Canada), their situation is a tad different from what I described above, but will investigate with them and report back

 

[TheCryptoAnt]

JJReddick said:
Yes.
Generally speaking you dont want to be in the position where you depend on contacts to fight for you within institution, because there are many, many things that can go wrong with it outside the scope/capabilities of even someone as Fred (I'm one of his clients btw).
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yeah word there nothing to argue against this.

JJReddick said:
This is why I was wondering what jurisdctions out there would work seamlessly if one was to move to a territorial taxation country while trading/investing through their corp, obvs with the objective of paying zero taxes while not formally breaking any laws or depending on contacts or goodwill of third parties.
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this is the main issue. those companies unless they have employees/multiple directors or the like... are being managed from TH and as a result are TH tax resident.
Now will this bring issues? Most likely not but in reality you never know and are kinda hoping things continue to be the way they currently are.

JJReddick said:
I have friends running a prop trading desk in Singapore (they relocated from Canada), their situation is a tad different from what I described above, but will investigate with them and report back
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Singapore is not a bad place to live! Taxes are not super high and quality of living is great.
They got a bit totalitarian during Covid tho so theres that.

Hope you end up fixing your situation. And if you end up in TH, enjoy it!

 

[JJReddick]

TheCryptoAnt said:
yeah word there nothing to argue against this.



this is the main issue. those companies unless they have employees/multiple directors or the like... are being managed from TH and as a result are TH tax resident.
Now will this bring issues? Most likely not but in reality you never know and are kinda hoping things continue to be the way they currently are.



Singapore is not a bad place to live! Taxes are not super high and quality of living is great.
They got a bit totalitarian during Covid tho so theres that.

Hope you end up fixing your situation. And if you end up in TH, enjoy it!
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cheers, appreciated 🙂