Offshore Portfolio Bonds

[John89]

I haven't been able to find information on this forum on Offshore Portfolio Bonds. Apparently you make a contract with an insurance company, and put a portfolio under their management (you can update it any time you want).
You can do it for example for 20 years, and withdraw 5% a year without paying UK taxes (I read about UK Offshore Portfolio Bonds, or Offshore Portfolio Bonds done for British people). At the end of 20 years you wind up the insurance product and pay the taxes you were due (so I guess you can move to a tax free jurisdiction for 3 months, wind it down, and then move back to where you lived before).
According to a website I read, after you give your money to the insurance company the company owns your assets, and they give you an ATM card in their name, so it's all anonymous.
I still have to read about it, and I am not 100% sure how it works, but I wanted to see if anybody has any knowledge/experience/comments about it.

 

[Gediminas]

Hey,

John89 said:
so I guess you can move to a tax free jurisdiction for 3 months, wind it down, and then move back to where you lived before
Click to expand...

This won't work for sure. At first, you would need to cut ties with the UK, and then, the next calendar year you could be considered as a tax resident in another country.

For some countries, 1 year is not enough, they require you to pay taxes even if you left the country 3-5 years ago.

Read this: RDR3: Statutory Residence Test (SRT) notes

You'll be UK resident for the tax year if you have, or have had, a home in the UK for all or part of the year and the following all apply:

• there is or was at least one period of 91 consecutive days when you had a home in the UK
• at least 30 of these 91 days fall in the tax year when you have a home in the UK and you've been present in that home for at least 30 days at any time during the year
• at that time you had no overseas home, or if you had an overseas home, you were present in it for fewer than 30 days in the tax year

If you have more than one home in the UK you should consider each of those homes separately to see if you meet the test. You need only meet this test in relation to one of your UK homes.
Click to expand...

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[Martin Everson]

John89 said:
I haven't been able to find information on this forum on Offshore Portfolio Bonds.
Click to expand...

I touched on the subject in response to a question in the mentor group.

John89 said:
According to a website I read, after you give your money to the insurance company the company owns your assets, and they give you an ATM card in their name, so it's all anonymous.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a scam.

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Please note my posts should not be taken as financial or tax advice. Please seek professional advice in that respect.

 

[John89]

Martin Everson said:
Sounds like a scam.
Click to expand...

This is copy-pasted from the website "Expatra". I hope I can copy paste the passage?? (reading again, it doesn't talk about an ATM card, but I would get a bank account in the name of the insurance company):

This company insures your life, establishes a bank account on your behalf, and you get an insurance policy from the insurance company in return.

Thus, you become a client of the insurance company, the insurance company becomes a client of the bank. Your investments are held within your insurance policy with you being the policyholder, and the bank account is held in the name of the insurance company.

The personal privacy afforded from an offshore portfolio bond can be increased by careful selection of the offshore jurisdiction in which the insurance company is based.

The primary level of protection comes from the fact that the underlying bank account is held in the name of the insurance company. The secondary level can come if you as the investor select an insurance company based in an offshore jurisdiction where it is strictly prohibited for insurance companies to divulge any client information.

 

[troubled soul]

If I get it right What you want to achive ,

Just Register Offshore Trust and Form IBC in which Trust is share holder , In this IBC name you can buy bond or stock with any offshore bank account which also give you visa/master card.

In this setup , You do not require to leave UK or any short of Drama.

This is just a Idea. I am not an UK resident or Expert.

Open for Criticism If I mention any thing wrong.

Thanks

 

[Martin Everson]

John89 said:
Thus, you become a client of the insurance company, the insurance company becomes a client of the bank. Your investments are held within your insurance policy with you being the policyholder, and the bank account is held in the name of the insurance company.
Click to expand...

I would need to analyze the policy itself. Currently under CRS cash value insurance contracts and annuity contracts are CRS re-portable.

You need to look at the underlying insurance company and policy terms. Typically these producsts are channel island company products from companies like RL360 where hidden agents are waiting to scalp you or misrepresent a product that won't achieve what you want.

Btw Expatra is a just a website run by a Russian chick. Is this who you want to hand money too?

https://expatra.com
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/09686420/officers

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Please note my posts should not be taken as financial or tax advice. Please seek professional advice in that respect.

 

[John89]

azb1 said:
If I get it right What you want to achive ,

Just Register Offshore Trust and Form IBC in which Trust is share holder , In this IBC name you can buy bond or stock with any offshore bank account which also give you visa/master card.

In this setup , You do not require to leave UK or any short of Drama.

This is just a Idea. I am not an UK resident or Expert.

Open for Criticism If I mention any thing wrong.

Thanks
Click to expand...

Thank you! This is good. I have two questions:

1) Suppose one day I want to withdraw some of the money to buy a house, or anything else. Wouldn't the tax authorities come to me and ask me where the money comes from? If they find out, I need to pay a big fine, so basically I wouldn't be able to withdraw large chunks of money for the rest of my life, right?

2) If I open an Offshore trust in Panama for example (I think they are cheap and easy to set up), where can I open an IBC? I guess I can in a country like Seychelles for example, but with an IBC in Seychelles which bank would actually agree to open an account? Maybe not a big and reliable one? With a Panama foundation would I be able to open an IBC in a reliable, low tax jurisdiction, like Switzerland, Bulgaria, etc.?

Thank you!!

 

[troubled soul]

John89 said:
Thank you! This is good. I have two questions:

1) Suppose one day I want to withdraw some of the money to buy a house, or anything else. Wouldn't the tax authorities come to me and ask me where the money comes from? If they find out, I need to pay a big fine, so basically I wouldn't be able to withdraw large chunks of money for the rest of my life, right?

2) If I open an Offshore trust in Panama for example (I think they are cheap and easy to set up), where can I open an IBC? I guess I can in a country like Seychelles for example, but with an IBC in Seychelles which bank would actually agree to open an account? Maybe not a big and reliable one? With a Panama foundation would I be able to open an IBC in a reliable, low tax jurisdiction, like Switzerland, Bulgaria, etc.?

Thank you!!
Click to expand...

1) Suppose one day I want to withdraw some of the money to buy a house, or anything else. Wouldn't the tax authorities come to me and ask me where the money comes from? If they find out, I need to pay a big fine, so basically I wouldn't be able to withdraw large chunks of money for the rest of my life, right?

ANS: Why don't you take a loan from your own company . As I can understand My whole setup is legal nothing Wrong , Nobody going to fine you.

2) If I open an Offshore trust in Panama for example (I think they are cheap and easy to set up), where can I open an IBC? I guess I can in a country like Seychelles for example, but with an IBC in Seychelles which bank would actually agree to open an account? Maybe not a big and reliable one? With a Panama foundation would I be able to open an IBC in a reliable, low tax jurisdiction, like Switzerland, Bulgaria, etc.?

ANS: Depend on your Money You have . For High value Switzerland Will be all time best.

P.S. I am not Expert . If you have Large chunk of money, Before Taking any Decision, Do consultant Local Tax Lawyer or consultant . (Do not believe online Material with High amount of Money ,Any wrong Move, It costs you fortune )

Thanks

 

[Golden Fleece]

John89 said:
I haven't been able to find information on this forum on Offshore Portfolio Bonds. Apparently you make a contract with an insurance company, and put a portfolio under their management (you can update it any time you want).
You can do it for example for 20 years, and withdraw 5% a year without paying UK taxes (I read about UK Offshore Portfolio Bonds, or Offshore Portfolio Bonds done for British people). At the end of 20 years you wind up the insurance product and pay the taxes you were due (so I guess you can move to a tax free jurisdiction for 3 months, wind it down, and then move back to where you lived before).
According to a website I read, after you give your money to the insurance company the company owns your assets, and they give you an ATM card in their name, so it's all anonymous.
I still have to read about it, and I am not 100% sure how it works, but I wanted to see if anybody has any knowledge/experience/comments about it.
Click to expand...

If you have a seven-figure portfolio, you may wish to consider investing in farmland and having it professionally managed by a team with established expertise, who may already manage their own successful farm operation.

The ROI beats almost every other investment. Of course, you have risk in locating the right management team, which can be mitigated by boots-on-the ground due diligence, but it is still much less risky than turning over your entire portfolio to random people in Russia.

Bear in mind that these yields are for U.S. farmland. If you own a farm in Latin America, where the price of farmland is half as much and the cost of labor is half as much, then . . . well, you can do the math. With that much cash flow, the tax issues become negligible. In other words, would you rather pay zero tax on a 5% yield or 15% tax on a 15% to 20% yield?

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Last edited: Mar 24, 2021

 

[John89]

azb1 said:
ANS: Why don't you take a loan from your own company . As I can understand My whole setup is legal nothing Wrong , Nobody going to fine you.
Click to expand...

Well, if I don't declare it to the tax office, it's illegal.

 

[troubled soul]

John89 said:
Well, if I don't declare it to the tax office, it's illegal.
Click to expand...

Declare it , If you remit money to your country then the money as profit/dividend is Taxable. Money in the Trust/Company account is not taxable.
And If you take Loan from that entity It is also not taxable